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Harringay, Haringey - So Good they Spelt it Twice!

There has been a bit of support for taking photos of rubbish left on The Ladder streets on one day in the summer - Sunday 9 July. The idea is that all the photos are posted on this discussion, one post per street with pics, and then forwarded to the Cabinet Member for Environment.

http://www.harringayonline.com/forum/topics/rubbish

It not a major undertaking, just up one side of the street and down the other, not forgetting the bits at the tops and bottoms of the road on Green Lanes and Wightman.

So far we have the following rubbish photographers

Justin Guest - Pemberton
Kotkas - Mattison and Duckett
Me - Warham, Seymour, Allison and Beresford (and Lausanne if my legs hold out)
Els - Sydney and Raleigh
Osbawn - Avondale
John D - Hampden and Frobisher
DS - Fairfax and Falkland
Hugh - Hewitt
ThaiDi -Hermitage
GraemeTP - Effingham
Gordon T - Cavendish and all points south

Michael

Tags for Forum Posts: dumping, rubbish, veolia, waste collection, waste collection charges

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Emina. Well done for being brave enough to come back to Osbawn on this, it is not easy to publicly admit your own failings- none of us are perfect. I would say, Osbawn lives on the other side of GL, and he could easily be referring to a St Annes ward Councillor?!

As Osbawn was the character who started off my legal defence fund nearly four years ago may I be the first to start off his and Emine's "give up smoking fund" by pledging £100 to the charity of their choice should they BOTH manage to give up smoking until at least the end of the year?

Hello Emine,

Thank you for posting and for your candour.

‘Yesterday’ is always relative but the one I was referring to was Saturday rather than the Sunday when you were down sarf presumably evangelising about how things norf of the river are generally superior.  However, as you said you’ve not been in the Salisbury during the day for months, I must be wrong and am sorry. You no doubt have a twin or a doppelgänger who is constantly wondering why people stop them in the street and ask why their bins are being repeatedly returned 3 inches to the left of their ‘correct’ position by errant bin men and why the Council is not doing everything in its power to find moggy who has been missing for days.

Thanks for being conscious of the need to bin the butts. Without wanting to sound patronising, I wish others would follow your lead. I’m sure you’ve noticed from posts on here alone that there is a massive sense of helplessness and despair about the wider issue of littering and that there is a groundswell of support for action. The question is what could or should that action be?

Everyone knows that the Borough has big problems and that you and Council staff are dealing with complex, challenging and draining problems associated with access to depleted services for vulnerable people, ensuring schools are up to scratch and social housing is available and fit for purpose. There is only so much time, money and effort available so I can’t fault the focus being given to the highest priorities. Nevertheless, the litter problem remains and is getting worse. It effects everyone in the borough east of the tracks irrespective of social, age or economic divisions and really brings the area down. Even if Council resources do not enable it to do much, I think a lot of people would still like to see it doing something.

I can’t help thinking that much of the culture change necessary wouldn’t be too resource onerous. If I ask the wo/man on the street to put her cigarette in the bin or the shopkeeper to stop sweeping his rubbish into the street I’ll get a load of abuse and probably a smack in the face. But if you ask the shopkeeper or engage the Traders in a campaign they should listen. If the Council can organise a few creative posters for shop windows or a couple of staff to stand on Green Lanes for a few hours every couple of Saturdays (paid of course) with a ‘help keep the environment clean’ message that will help, if Councillor Aymet or Kober sent a twitter message out (on-line to avoid paper cost and litter) to explain what they’re doing to get Veolia to improve its performance it would help (purple bags dumped on the footpath for days on end simply encourage more litter). If the Traders Association got together to create a ‘good neighbour’ statement showing what they will do to contribute to the cleanliness of Green Lanes that would help too. All those things should be reasonably easy to arrange and would give residents some comfort that someone is on their side. Would you and the other ward Councillors get behind an effort to have Harringay awarded a Keep Britain Tidy green flag or something similar? All those things would help and I’m sure Alan Stanton would have some obscure authors for us to read who profess deeper knowledge of the issues and more nuanced solutions.

They’re the carrots but the stick would help too. I’m not a fan of non-State employees dishing out fines to members of the public but if that will help fix the problem then I’m willing to look past my liberal reservations and support the use of private wardens to issue fixed penalty notices. I thought Haringey Council was too but I’m yet to see one of the enforcers. They’d only need to wander up and down Green Lanes a few times a week to provide a healthy income stream for the council coffers which could be reused for the nicer initiatives. They’d also help change at least some of the behaviour. Surely copping a fine in Hackney stuck in the mind at least for a while.

How about a press release:

Haringey Council announces the ‘Great Harringay Clean-up: Making the Lanes Green Again’. Emine Ibrahim, local community groups, Veolia and the Traders’ Association are having a day of action! We’ll be scrubbing footpaths, removing oil stains outside restaurants, sweeping up litter, removing fly-tippings and resetting the standard! Veolia, the Council’s waste removal provider, following encouragement from the Council hierarchy, has agreed to make a special off-cycle pick up along Green Lanes to remove all the additional bagged waste from the bottom of Ladder and top of Gardens roads. Residents and Traders are invited to bring a broom and a bucket for a 4 hours deep clean of Green Lanes and adjacent roads. There will be entertainment for the kids, a free sausage/vege sizzle for volunteers and loads of environmental information. Come one, come all – Sunday the Xth of X 2017 0830-1230am (to beat the Sunday kebab crowds).

But in all seriousness, if there is something that a group of community members could do to help reduce the litter and engage the powers that be (official and unofficial, salaried and expensed) at the Council, what would you suggest? We need some help?

Happy to buy you a coffee and discuss. I don’t smoke contrary to now popular opinion but I’ll buy you one of those too (though perhaps not from John McMullan’s supplier).

Osbawn, you are now officially marvellous.

Good God, Osbawn, your ambition knows no bounds. Are you really trying to smoke the entire "cabinet" and their officers out of their burrows?

Sorry for the misspelling Emina.
Happy to meet with you and community members on this . John has emailed me about it and we just need to coordinate a time for all three cllrs. On the cigarette butt issue - bad habits breed bad habits ultimately but enforcement whilst important in changing behaviour until everyone gives up then it will be an issue particularly as rightly people have to smoke outside now. I know from my own experience of trying to find somewhere to put it out that whilst bins are the right place if there is no external facilities my pet hate is when someone doesn't put it out properly and you see bins with smoke streaming out. The number of times I have had to empty remains of water in bag or my overpriced latte!! And of course at bus stops so many people quickly stub out cigarettes before getting on bus or at train stations. Hence why you see enforcement operations at tube stations often. That's when us lot are at our most absent minded so focussed on running down the escalator not to be late on Monday morning! Because you never know there may not be a train for another 1 whole minute! :)

The Salisbury has a bucket :)

Nice one, Osbawn. You've managed to smoke at least one Labour councillor out of hiding. Brilliant ploy! But as far as bad habits go, I'd prefer fags and butts any day to so-called 'smartphones'. No Green Lanes or Wightman Road pedestrian has ever walked blindly into me on the footpath because they were smoking or stubbing out their butts, whereas dumbphoneusers do so regularly. Stub out the rubbish dumbphones, say I, not the fag butts.

I dunno Okd Age everyone knows my coffee and cigarette habit so am hardly hiding it :) I am not 15 and standing behind bikesheds. I am sure Osbawn has seen me succumb to the temptation of lighting up with my cappuccino, latte, or Turkish coffee on Green Lanes before too. Unfortunately coffee and cigarettes are my very negative trademark it doesn't mean I don't agree with dealing with the issue and I welcome enforcement.

Nice one, Osbawn. You've managed to smoke at least one Labour councillor out of hiding. Brilliant ploy! 

Oh no, Emine. I wasn't suggesting you've been hiding your coffee or cigarette habit. Just hiding.

Well your clearly wrong though you and Osbawn have never hid your disdain for me my politics and pretty much everything else. Though I have to say well done John Mcmullan for revealing that Osbawn himself shares my smoking habit. At the very least I am putting my hands up and saying that it's very improbable that I have never discarded my cigarette. I love honesty I also love honesty and fairness :)

Emine. I mean this in the nicest possible way - could you have a look in your Haringey.gov inbox and see if you have a mail from me ? ( two actually )

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